That Hamilton Woman - Discussion

[David]

Discussion topic for this "weekend theater's" film, "That Hamilton Woman" 1941,starring Laurence Olivier and Vivien Leigh. Keep in mind there may be spoilers here, so watch the film before hand!

[carlos]

Children: as I said before I have some very interesting facts about this film- I am going to write, them, tomorrow for all of you- Uncle.

[carlos]

Some facts about "That Hamilton Woman"-
These facts never appeared in a book- I know them because I had conversations with people who knew Vivien -
- The English Goverment issued Alexander Korda to make a film to help their Country- England was in her worst as Nazis were bombing English cities- So.. they needed help from Allies- Especially from USA-
- Korda, in Hollywood, decided to film "That Hamilton Woman" with the hottest couple in Hollywood: Vivien Leigh fresh from her triumph as Scarlett in GWTW and Olivier in "Whutering Heights"- In 1940 they were the most glamorous and searched Stars on the Movie Capital- BUT... they did "Romeo & JUliet" on Broadway with terrible reviews !!- So.. they needs money to return to England- Vivien was very concerned about her only daughter, so the money from the film was something like a miracle: she sent for Suzzane and for her own mother, Gertrude, and sent them to Canada-
- In August 1940 they, finally becomes a marriage: Kate Hepburn and Garson Kanin as best woman and best man- They were married OUTSIDE Hollywood so no one knew it until the other day- When the judge saw the couple to be married he shouts: "Oh my God !!.. Scarlett O,Hara and Heathcliff !!!!"- hehe-
- Alexander Korda based his film in a recently published book about Lord Nelson & Emma Lady Hamilton: Inside the book there were some original portraits of Emma who incredible so were very acurrate with Vivien,s face!!.
- He casts the best talents to recreate Naples, the ships etc- BUT... the film has to be done in 15 days, because Vivien & Olivier were very anxious to go to England and help in the War-
- One of the things that are absolutely incredible is that both Stars used make-up in the parts of their faces to be seen- For example: if they were on profile, they worn make-up only in THAT profile !!- hehe- Just to gain time !!
- In one of the scenes, Vivien had to be carried up to the ship- The scenario was just like a ship and moving with the water- Vivien.. after 5 takes begans to shout: "My Dear God... I,m sick !!!!... I want to v..."- hehe
- In other scene, Korda told Vivien: " My dear Vivien..Emma WAS vulgar !"- Vivien: "My dear Alex, if I have ever been vulgar you would never have asked me to do the role !!"-
- Korda and Vivien (more than with Olivier) wre like brothers- They loved each other inmensly.
- In the scenes where Emma was old and drunk.. they put rubber-wrinkles to her.. and Vivien "lows" the tone of her voice so she could sound like an older woman- Many people (including David, hehe ) thought another actress played this scenes-
- As she knew perfectly well Italian, French and German.. in some scenes she talked perfectly well Italian- And in those scenes she prooved to be an excelent comedy-actress,.
- Something with the Movie-Script has to be done to "gain" help from the Allies: so.. in all of Lord Nelson,s monologues, he supposedly was talking about Napoleon...BUT... in fact he was talking about Hitler- You must listen to him to understand this- It,s very, very clear. Also the scenes with Lord Hamilton and Emma, where he explains the war, and Britain,s duty., to her... are absolutely "direct" of what was happening in 1940. One of the actresses was Gladys Cooper, a close friend of "The Oliviers" and mother of the last Vivien,s fiancee (after her divorce) !!
- Everything was done as a "propaganda film", and indeed it was !!- Inmediately after the premiere, USA began to help Britain.. This was wonderful, so: Korda was made "Lord", by England,s Goverment, The film turns to be the fav of Winston Churchill (Prime Minister) and Hitler puts a price to the heads of Korda, Vivien and Olivier !!!!- Vivien was soooo happppyyyy with this that she said: "Well, at least I did SOMETHING against Nazis!!. I,m VERY proud !!"- hehe
- Churchill in fact becomes a fan of the film, and he shows "That Hamilton.." to every one of his guests in his home- He said: " This girl (Vivien) is the most exquisite thing I have ever seen "- Their admiration for each other endures till his death, in 1965, and in one of the last visit, Vivien made to Churchill..he gaves her an oil painting (painted by himself) of "Lady Hamilton". Vivien carried this painting, with her, in every tour she made-
- One scene is famous: When Emma is sitting in a couch and her mother told her that Nelson was in the balcony waiting for her: that scene shows, absolutely, the love, the passion, between Vivien & Olivier, and Korda cried after finishing. ( it,s my own fav scene... and Sarah,s !!)
- "That Hamilton Woman" was a hit- So, both Stars were the hottest property in Hollywood when they were under the Nazis bombs in London, with cold, without proper meals and Olivier flying air-planes, and Vivien in the hot desert making plays for the soldiers- They were both awarded by English Goverment- Also Vivien received the "Cross of Honor" from France, for her helping to the French-Resistence,
- My last comment: In 1981, 40 years after making the film and 14 years after Vivien,s death, a friend of Olivier went to his home and finds him crying, looking at a film on TV- That film was "That Hamilton Woman", and Olivier only said: "This was LOVE... this IS pure and simple love...."-

uncle-

[carlos]

PS- more information-

When Nelson told the King of Naples " You have to be strong !!!- if not you will be invaded by Napoleon !!" .. in fact Nelson (England) was saying " Be strong against Hitler, if not he will invade you ".
When Lord Hamilton tells Lady Nelson (Gladys Cooper) that sometimes is" best to accept facts as they came instead of trying to fight against them".. he was saying : " English people, be strong BUT accept the difficulties (by bombs) - be close, help each other-we can do anything against it "-
All scenes of Lady Hamilton helping Nelson with troops from Naples... are like: " Hey.. Americans!!.. help us because if not we are lost, we need help"-
All this (and much more scenes that YOU will find ) in a "romantic, luxurious, beautifully mounted film"-

WATCH CLOSELY the last scene.. (of a still young Lady Hamilton), when that officer goes to her home to tell her (PAUSE)...you know what..- Watch how Vivien, without ANY word express everything only by her face and eyes- An example of a MASTER CLASS of acting in Classic Movies-
This film made in 15 days is, surely, an example of what Hollywood Studios were capable to do in those " Golden Days"- As Olivier said: "We were all professionals, and we love our work"- AMEN- or DITTO as Dan says-

[SarLei]

Wow, Uncle, that was a lot of information - thanks for sharing it!

- Spoilers ahead -

It didn't occur to me before that this surely was a propaganda movie, I knew that it was Churchill's favourite, but it somehow never came to my mind. Of course, now that I know, it's very clear. And I like it. Because it's a very clever way of propaganda. Other movies like "Mrs. Miniver" were much more clear in their message, not to speak of American propaganda movies during the war.
And I agree with Laurence Olivier (this, again, is a very lovely and somehow sad information) when he says that they both were very truly and very much in love in the movie. Every scene shows it - when Emma jokes about Nelson's facial expressions, when it's New Years eve, when she's hurt because she met his wife and says good night to him...not to mention my favourite scene! They had all sorts of love scenes in the movie and so the love story had a great variety of aspects.
I think I don't have to start about how much I love the performances, they were all great. And Vivien was simply too pretty to look at sometimes.
I think the final dialouge in the prison is so romantic! Everything about this movie is for me.
But, the most awesome thing really is the music. Sadly, you cannot get the whole soundtrack anywhere but I downloaded the love theme (very lovely) and did cut parts of the movie out for the music's sake, like the balcony scene because the music is so beautiful there.

"That Hamilton Woman" is one of my favourite movies, really, it's such a great love story. And it really happened in a way, so that makes it even more nice. Besides, you can never go wrong with Mr. Churchills favourite movie, can you?

[David]

Thank you again Uncle, for sharing that wealth of information! I, like Sarah, hadn't previously thought that this was a propaganda film (and a clever one at that!)

[carlos]

Thank you so much Sarah & David !!- As you can see.. I LOVE giving information about Vivien,s films-
In the case of THIS film , as Sarah said, a VERY clever way to film a propaganda... Of course Korda wants to "hide" it among the great romantic scenes...and the lush in scenarios and clothes- So public rushed to see it- Another clever thing, by Korda, is the choosing of actors: Vivien & Olivier were famous, at that time, as "The Great Lovers", so the story of Emma and Nelson fits like a glove to them- Same story.. but different lovers-
About the music: Milkos Rozsa, one of the great composers of film-music, really did a beautiful job- He had a very short time to write music for "That Hamilton..", and it is consider one of his best works- I have a LP with the music of the film, but NOT the original soundtrack: in 1980 I bought in the States an Album with the best of Rozsa, and there is a suite with the complete music directed by himself-
I did the same, Sarah: I copy in a cassette some parts of the film (dialogues and music) so I can have" the original score"- And each time I hear it.. it gives me the chills !!!!
The music in the scene of the balcony is SPLENDID !!- It has a "crescendo" while Emma runs to meet Nelson... So much force, romanticism...that matches perfectly well with that scene- AND HER FACE !!!!!!-
Also... the song "Danny Boy" (AKA: "Londonderry Air") sang by men in the ships in the "new Year,s scene" was a kind of propaganda- That song is very important to English people so putting it in the film..was a kind of "giving them strengh", and I think, as many, that THAT version is the best I have ever heard-
Lovely, lovely film- uncle

[Ivonne]

Carlos: I am going to save all this- It is VERY interesting !!- I remember when I first saw this film.. I thought: "Well, THIS is a beautiful love Story " !!- I can understand NOW why I felt that !!- And seeing this film AFTER reading those things you wrote is "different"- I can understand MORE- THANK YOU !!!!!

[David]

Carlos: I am going to save all this- It is VERY interesting !!- I remember when I first saw this film.. I thought: "Well, THIS is a beautiful love Story " !!- I can understand NOW why I felt that !!- And seeing this film AFTER reading those things you wrote is "different"- I can understand MORE- THANK YOU !!!!!

Absolutely Ivonne! Despite my bias against period films (ah, bad me ), "That Hamilton Woman" is seriously a true love story.

[Reanne]

WOW! Vivian was just too beautiful... her face and expressions were stunning!She was truly spectacular!!!!!!! Although I can't say I liked Oliver... nope! I didn't!